Monday, April 23, 2007

Questions from an Odinist

I believe that Jesus existed, however, I do not believe he was the son of God.

That's a fairly common point of view. The problem is that Jesus claimed to be the son of God and claimed all the authorities of God Himself, so what you need to ask yourself is, "was Jesus lying, crazy, or is he God?" Those are the only 3 options. I've heard a lot of talk about him being a good person and even a profit, but those are impossible conclusions.

Christians gladly point out that there is ample evidence suggesting Jesus was the son of God. What is that evidence? Because, frankly, all I find is some pseudo-scientifical babble that supposedly proves his resurrection (which is fysically impossible)

Unfortunately, nothing historical can be 100% proven scientifically. The very crux of science hangs on repeatability, which discounts proving miracles for obvious reasons but also discounts historical events. The best we can do for evidence is by using a courtroom example. Lee Strobel's "The Case for Christ" does a pretty good job of examining this evidence, but I can give you a few snapshots from my memory of the book. Lawyers would use physical evidence (like the crosses and crucified bodies archaeoligists have uncovered that show the practice), documentation (such as the records of the non-Christian, Roman historian Josephus, who reports the death and burial of Jesus), eyewitnesses to Jesus after his death (of which there were more than 500 at a single time), credibility of those witnesses (their willingness to be tortured and killed for their testimony). There is a ton more on that, but more important is the evidence of the Trinity's interaction in our lives today (http://everystudent.com/~JeffGrant).

Also, if this "Son of God" was so peaceful and promised us a better world, why then did the Romans crucify him? Crucifixion was a punishment only reserverd for violent revolutionaries (f.ex. Spartacus) and murderers.

Are you aking if Jesus was peaceful, or questioning the fact of his crucifiction? The latter is recorded in Roman history. The former is easily enough explained by John 19:4-16. Many revolutionaries were crucified by the Romans for claiming to be the Messiah. It was the threat of the "King of the Jews" that the Romans were concerned about. Pilot (the Roman in who eventually ordered his execution) told the people that Jesus had done nothing to deserve death, but the Jewish officials persuaded him that if he didn’t condemn Jesus, he would be committing treason himself since Jesus claimed to be a king. For the Jewish leaders, Jesus had committed a crime by calling himself the Son of God which would be blasphemy from anyone but him and punishable by death.

you'd think the Romans, who were very passionate about noting down the facts of history, would have written something about those miracles...

No Roman historians were 1st person witnesses to the miracles, as far as I know. The Romans were, for the most part, skeptics. There are recordings of his death and his body’s disappearance are recorded, but any records of Jesus’ miracles would have been considered “Christian writing”, so probably wouldn’t have been included with their other documents. Most of this is a speculative comment, since I have not done deep research into Roman historical documents. Have you found that there are no records on miracles?

Resurrection from the grave is also historically impossible, since crucifixion "victims" were not interred at all, but rather left to rot.

It was the Jewish custom to bury the dead, not the Roman. This is documented in John 19:38 and also by Josephus, the Roman historian.

There is actually more historic and scientific evidence that Jesus was NOT the person that was described in the bible, but rather some Che Guevara of Antiquity...

I would certainly like to see your sources for such evidence. Please, tell me how you came to that conclusion.

So I would like to know what is this scientific evidence that proves al non-christians wrong...

I would be happy to examine any evidence against Christianity, as I have investigated the “Tomb of Jesus” claims and the “Da Vinci Code” claims. To date, however, the archaeological, scientific, and historical evidence has supported Biblical claims to the point that the British Museum (one of the most traditionally atheistic establishments in the world) actually displays Bible verses with their exhibits (click here to check it out).

Kind regards,
Patrick,
Belgium

PS: For the record, I am not an atheist, but an Odinist that is tired of seeing European people and their American cousins deny the faith of their ancestors, for a "peaceful" faith that was forced upon their ancestors with huge amounts of violence ( Charlemagne's persecutions of the "pagans", the Danish genocide, ...)

That is very interesting, Patrick! I would dearly enjoy hearing more about your belief in Odinism. I wasn't aware that the worship of the Norse Pantheon was still practiced. Do you feel that there is more evidence of their existence than that of Jesus?

~Jeff

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